Do you consider yourself resilient and what does that mean to you? In this podcast, Resilient Entrepreneurs with Two Four One, we chat with business owners about what resilience means to them as they share their inspiring stories and life lessons.
What we've learned running our own business, is you're never alone even when it feels like it. So tune in anytime to this podcast. We're always here for you celebrating resilient entrepreneurs just like you. We're Laura and Vicki from Two Four One - a marketing company for early stage business owners who want to launch, grow and be resilient.
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Hello and welcome back to Resilient Entrepreneurs. Today we have a very special guest, Pat Phillip-Fairn. She's the founder and CEO of Objective Consulting Limited is a company that provides strategic planning, content development, project management and executive communications coaching services. And with over 30 years of experience in various industry sectors, she's a true leader and expert in her field. But before starting her own company, our guest served as the Chief Product and Experiences Development Officer at the Bermuda Tourism Authority, where she was responsible for creating unforgettable experiences for visitors from around the world. And Laura and I were both very lucky to have worked alongside Pat, for several years during that time.
Pat’s also a member of the International Coaching Federation (ICF) and a practitioner of ICF coaching principles, so she knows how to help people reach their full potential. We're so thrilled to have you on the show today Pat, a very warm welcome to you. How are you doing?
Very very well, thank you so much for having me. It's great to be with you. It's great to see you both as well.
Yeah, same Pat. Thank you so much for joining us. So let's kick off right at the very beginning. I’d love to know, what was your first ever job and at what age.
So my first formal job was a Saturday job as we used to call it back in London where I grew up. And I worked at the department store in the hosiery section, in the hosiery department, which basically is tights and stockings and socks for women.
It makes me think of “Are You Being Served?”
Absolutely. If you think this was classic “Are You Being Served?” type department store, it was really. It really had those characters and as young girls sprinkled through on a Saturday morning and it was enormous fun. My mom said that she watched me walking to the bus stop the morning of the first day and she said, it's like you were taller, to be going off and earning my own money and stuff like that. It was.. I got six pounds for a Saturday, six pounds and seventy-two pence - that was my pay, my first paycheck for that sensitive job.
But my first actual being paid to provide a service would have been before that. It was a family friend, the daughter was eight years old and she was struggling in school. She was struggling with reading and then my uncle, he asked if I would help her. So I worked with her for the summer just doing letters and getting her up to speed and so on and she went back to school and she was much happier. And he gave me a wad of notes and said, Thanks, basically Thank You, because she's just a much happier kid now. So that was my first kind of side hustle if you like.
A coach from the very beginning.
When you think about it, yeah, I guess so.
Yeah. That's impressive. And so what got you into tourism? What was the lure there?
Hmm. So I worked out of university for a company called Cable and Wireless, a telecommunications company.
Know it well.
Yes. And I happened to work for the Bermuda Caribbean Division and it meant working with various types of companies, various categories because we were providing service to everyone. And tourism kept coming in and out of that for me. Then I eventually started traveling out to the region from London, went to see major clients who were in the tourism sector, when I ended up coming to Bermuda, my second job after leaving, you go somewhere new, you get a sales job, I got the sales job, did the sales job, left the sales job and then six months later, I applied for a job at tourism because I had relevant experience and that's how it happened, I ended up working for the Department of Tourism in the marketing department there.
So Pat I'd like to know, how did you get from tourism to what you're doing now in more of the coaching space?
So after really 30 years of working and working in Bermuda on both sides of the economy, so I worked on the tourism side first, then went into international business on that side of things, absolutely great, the Monetary Authority, back to tourism. I decided it was time to take a break. And it was basically the second time in my career that I left with no plan, nothing to go to. The first time actually, it was to spend more time with a very small child, my son at the time, and take a break then and ended up consulting, because I still needed to work, right, I've always had that drive. So at that time, I was editorial consultant, I did a lot of writing in the space one before my son went to school full time, then I went back into corporate after that.
This time around, I felt like after the BTA, you ladies know you worked on projects there, it was full on, intense, it was basically a huge startup and it really demanded a lot out of everybody to get a thing running, and then to get new ideas out there and get people on board with new ideas and doing things differently, and so on and so forth, coaching again, I guess that was throughout that process, too. And so it was time to take a break. It really was time to take a break.
I flirted with the idea of retirement and that was for about five minutes because I really still wanted, I wanted to do something and my husband was like, yes, you need to do something. Yes, Lady, you need to be occupied!
So that's when I thought about, well, what is it I want in this phase of life, I still want to contribute in some way, I want to use my skills, I still want to help people. I did a lot of coaching through the BMA years, as well. I've done a lot of coaching in-house if you like, in various positions I've had. And so I thought, Okay, in lockdown, this is what I'm gonna do, I'm going to have this as my pet project. And I put a few feelers out and the next thing you know, I started getting clients. And it started off with the coaching first. It then morphed into strategic planning, which I've done a lot of in my career as well in-house again. And then I thought to myself, You know what I could just distill, it looks like there's a need here, I could distill the things that I love to do, just get rid of all the other stuff. I sort of filtered everything out and I realised, yeah, it's Strat Planning, it's coaching, it's still writing, I've just done a big technical writing piece for the Ministry of Finance, just now, that kind of thing. And yeah, and then just projects. I wanted, at this time in my life, flexibility to still make a contribution and to do interesting projects and work with great people. That's the business plan!
That's a brilliant business plan. I say that’s a brilliant business plan because the one thing we get to do as entrepreneurs, as people working for ourselves, is to choose who we work with. And in this stage of life, I speak for myself, that's probably one of the most important things.
Oh, it's the best, it really is the best. I have said no to some things already along the way, you know, I've really been going since I would say 2021, like full on business, not kind of a side thing, or hobby. And some things have come along and the first time you say no to something, it is scary.
Let's talk about it. Yeah. What was the thought process when you were getting to that?
I've always followed my gut. You make logical, data-based decisions in life, right? But my intuition has never let me down. So I balanced it right. I remember the principles. I'm starting the business, I want to work on interesting projects and great people, and contribute my skills that way. And so somebody approached me about a particular thing and I thought, Yes, I could take that money but that project would very quickly stop giving me any kind of joy. That project could just drag me back to a place of imbalance and not feeling great. And so I said, No, and it was, it was scary, it was scary because it's revenue, right? But at the end of the day, I was really glad that I had the courage, I guess, to say no, because it takes courage to say no, as an entrepreneur, when somebody's presenting you with something that could add to your bottom line, and if it's a nice fee you really, it's a test. I took it as a test and I gave myself and a good grade for saying no, because I realised, as things turned out when I looked at what happened with that, I had I made the right decision,
As you do every time, yeah.
Do you believe that saying no, opens you up for the next Yes?
Absolutely and in fact, you saying that - not two weeks after saying no, I got a new project which I still have and I love. Yeah. It opens the door, it makes space for something else. And if you look at it that way, it's less scary to say no.
Yeah, you almost have to go through that experience to know it because the first time is terrifying, especially when your business is in the early stages, which a lot of the people who listen to this podcast probably are in early stages of their business. And you're still trying to figure it out and you just want to say yes to everything. And what does that lead to?, Overwhelm, scarcity mindset. imposter syndrome sneaks in, all the negative stuff, it's just the hardest thing to get through in the early stages. So do you have advice for those people that are just starting out and are going through all those negative, fearful, nervous first steps out the gate? Like, what would you tell somebody, maybe that you worked with, that they were ready to take that leap into entrepreneurship or just starting out and they're going through all those emotions?
I would say be very, very clear on what it is that you're offering. What is your purpose? What is the purpose of your business? What is the problem you're solving? Be clear on that. Because then you can stay focused. So if something is put in front of you that does not align with that, then it's easier for you to retain clarity, get through the.. I'm going to say yes to everything. If you're clear on your purpose and what it is that you're actually providing, then if something is put in front of you that doesn't align with that, then you can decide, okay, really, should I be doing this? Is this in my skill set? Or is this helping me to solve that problem I identified, is it really in alignment with what I do? And who I am; never forget your values as well, as you go through the entrepreneurial journey. Because that, again, can help you to stay focused and really understand what your objective is for your business.
I named the business and it's funny because I was going through the naming process, which was quite fun, and my husband, who is a serial entrepreneur, he actually we did a bit of brainstorming and he actually helped me to name the business because I kept going back to.. always with my teams and in my career, always making sure that you're clear on your objective. I'll talk with the team and I'll say, Okay, what are we trying to achieve? If we don't know what our objective is then we don't know what we're trying to do, what the outcome, the desired outcome needs to be. That means we don't align what we're doing with that, we don't set a direction properly. We go off on a tangent if we don't know what we're trying to achieve. And so stay focused on your objective. Always, always have your values in sight when you're making these decisions and then you'll be able to take that leap and say no to the things you should be saying no to, and be able to provide your service, and always provide your service with clarity.
And it also helps you to attract the type of business that you do want because if you're clear on your values and your objective, then when you're talking to people that comes through, even if it's just a social setting or a networking setting and then someone else will refer you to someone that they're talking to, and you don't even know where that person, where that next client came from some of the time, but if you're clear when you're talking to everybody about what you do I think it just multiplies in its power.
Agreed. Absolutely right.
And we’re true believers in the values thing. In fact, it was really the very first thing that Laura and I did before we even started working together as Two Four One was, we had a brainstorming session, we decided, you tell me what your values are and I'll tell you what mine are and hey, presto, they aligned and they went right up on the website and that was.. it's been like that since the first day.
Yep, that's great.
Great advice.
It really does. It grounds you and it really strips things away. If you stay focused on your objective and really lean into your values, you can then make decisions with a lot more clarity.
And do you have any thoughts that would help somebody get clear on their objective because a lot of the time when we're starting out, we have a bit of a vague idea about who we're going to serve and what the problem is that we're solving. But I find in my experience, a lot of early stage businesses think they know that, but they're not crystal clear on it, or they're not very focused, they haven't niched down, they haven't really, they're not razor sharp on what their objective is.
I think it's really good to.. if you're not absolutely clear is to get help with that. Look at the resources that are available. I mean, BEDC (Bermuda Economic Development Corporation) for example, I think is a great organisation, I was on the board there for a while. Look at the resources that are around you, if there are entrepreneurs in your family, if you don't want to go that route, what you need to do is talk through, get a sounding board, even if it's just to put the idea on the table and say, Well, who is this for, and say to someone, Does this make sense? Because sometimes you can be in your own head, as an entrepreneur you really can be in your own head a lot of the time. And you don't necessarily, in those moments, give yourself the best advice unless you really are very, very clear on what you want to do. So I would say get some feedback from a trusted source to help you get there. If you're not clear on what it is that you're actually offering and who you want to offer it to.
Yeah, that's so true. And we've talked about this before with other entrepreneurs. A lot of times the people closest to you, they want to protect you, right? And when people take that first leap into entrepreneurship, family and friends will often say Oh, are you sure, you're going to lose your health insurance and the guaranteed this and the safety of a job, which we all know is crazy and nonsense, because no job is safe when you work for somebody else. But it's a much bigger risk to take that leap on your own and I totally agree with you, the support is key, finding a community, a mentor, a program, like BEDC or Ignite (Accelerator) as well is great for helping entrepreneurs get themselves off the ground and get that advice they need from people who have been there before them. So that's why consultants like you, and coaches are so important, because I think it helps get mindset right. And once you kind of get the mindset, other things fall into place and learning things like you were talking about with the niching down to who and what and who you serve and what you do. It’s so key, but people are often afraid of that. Right? They're really afraid of niching, they're afraid of saying no, they're afraid of, it's that scarcity mindset that we get stuck in because it's, Oh, I don't know when the next client is coming, I don't know when the next payment is coming in and that is the most scary thing about entrepreneurship, especially in the beginning until you get your feet underneath you. So that fear of failure comes into play really early. What's your mindset on failure? How do you embrace it?
Yeah, I think failure is an opportunity, right? If you don't fail, if you don't have setbacks, you don't grow. So for me, that kind of thing is really a growth opportunity. I've said to my son in his life always, don’t be afraid, don’t be afraid of not getting it right. There is nobody in the world who gets 100% of everything, 100% right all the time. And if you do fail, take a lesson from it. What is this? What am I supposed to learn from this? And how am I supposed to grow from it? That's my perspective on failure. What is this teaching me? And how will I grow? So don't be afraid to fail. Don't be afraid of setbacks. Just use them to learn. Learn more about yourself, learn more about the service that you're offering if you need to make some adjustments, or learn more about your clients, there's an opportunity for growth in failure. You shouldn't be afraid to fail. Failing up, right.
Failing up and failing forward
There was part of the coaching, credentialing and so on, one of the assessments, this is what happened, I had an assessment as part of the coaching education and I fit this interview assessment in with a client meeting and a coaching session, ironically enough, and it was quite a busy day and so I thought I was prepared for this session and I wasn't at the end of the day, I wasn't. And so I literally, I stopped everything when I realised, and I said, This is not working, this is not working. And so I had to reschedule everything and I thought I was going to nail this thing that day and then keep going with my day. And it was a bit of a.. it was a setback for me in the sense that I didn't realise that I needed to sit myself down and really prepare for this session. I thought I was prepared for it but obviously I wasn't. And the lesson obviously was, Give yourself enough time and respect for what you are trying to achieve so that you are prepared and then you can move forward with it. So what did I learn? I learned to give myself time, I learned that actually I need to treat myself like I would treat my clients. Be very prepared, be ready to serve them properly and be ready to put my best foot forward in all situations for them. So I needed to be my own client. And so maintaining a balance between making sure that you are serving yourself properly as well as serving your business and your clients was the lesson for me there.
I can't help but smile Pat because for our listeners, for both of us having worked alongside Pat, this lady is a powerhouse. This lady is the one who you feel like just has Teflon, like thick Teflon, so it doesn't matter what else is falling around.. falling down around her. She's just sailing through picking up pieces, putting it all together with a big smile and a bow on top. I mean that is Pat Phillip-Fairn to work with. It's such a joy. And you never imagined that Pat would ever have a moment or a setback, so I do appreciate you sharing that and being so candid about it and I think yeah, and I'm also smiling, because it's the kind of thing I would do. It's like, oh, yeah, I can just squeeze that in between this and that, even though it's important. I’ve got this! Touch it and it turns to gold, everything's good. And then we get caught out sometimes so it's a good reminder.
It was a good lesson for me. I mean, I really, I needed it. I think I needed it.
Yeah. And just on the coaching thing in the beginning of this episode, you said, you decided to be a coach and then the clients started coming, and it all just sounded so easy. And we have quite a number of coaches listening to this podcast, as new entrepreneurs, so tell us, how did you get coaching clients? What was that journey like?
So I started looking for resources around this when I decided, yes, I want to go and do this properly, and get paid to do it. So first of all, I did some learning and went online and did a few courses and started following some people online who are coaches and have successful thriving coaching businesses. So I got a lot of tips and so on and how to build a business. And then I started prospecting among people that I'd worked with. So having started the business, it was a perfect opportunity to say, Hey, everyone, this is what I'm doing now, I had a break and this is what I'm doing now and this is what I do and this is how I help people. And I mean, I'm making it sound easier than it probably was but you have to look around you to decide where you're going to prospect, as an entrepreneur, where are your customers? Where are your clients? And so I looked at it in circles, like concentric circles. The first circle was immediately who I've worked with before. So I started making calls and talking to people and someone I used to work with at the BMA, I coached her a lot actually. BMA was great in terms of coaching, you’ve got a lot of technically brilliant people, really bright people working there, but when it comes to speaking to others and communicating, it's kind of urgh, they clam up, right. So I did a lot of coaching there, but she contacted me and she's a very senior person in insurance now. She said, Oh, my God, I heard about your business and I’ve got to tell you I'm still using stuff that you taught me back at the BMA which is very gratifying. And so I got some referrals from people that I had worked with before. And then I spoke with one of my former colleagues at the Hamilton Princess, they are a client of mine. And he said, Oh, my God, yes, yes, I need you. And so he started sending me people from their management team - he said, Yeah, I have to do all the presentations and frankly, I'm sick of it. These guys have got to step up, I really need them to step up. And so that happened and so I had a pipeline of coachees from Hamilton Princess, as well, who are wonderful clients. And so that's how I started; I just went out and I talked to the people I know, the decision makers, let's say, that I've worked with before and that's how the clients started to come.
One of the things I know is having had that network of people, it's been a blessing. It's been an absolute blessing. So you never know, I always used to say, make your friends before you need them because you never know when you'll need them, and so you look to your network, for me and that's how it worked, I looked at my network first and then started going further. I'm now in the process of thinking, Well, should I be doing more on LinkedIn now? Maybe, that kind of thing. So I'm now in the second phase of going to the wider circle and thinking about how to do that, so my network has served me very well.
Yeah, it's always about relationships, isn't it?
Definitely. Definitely. I would say in the first six months, I had a retainer client, I had a really great strategic planning project, I had started the coaching as well, that new pipeline of coaching, and so I had a really good base to start with, and then from that comes referrals after that.
Yeah. Fantastic. You're definitely up and running and what at this stage of the game, would you say is the best part about being an entrepreneur or working for yourself?
Oh, gosh, picking your projects, right? I mean, I love being able to pick projects and also have the flexibility that goes with charting your own course, that's wonderful to be able to, I'm so grateful and just really really grateful to have the opportunity to do what I do, in the way that I do it. I'm able to work pretty much remotely all the time, I'm very rarely in person meetings with my clients which means I get to live half the year in Bermuda and half the year in St. Lucia where my family's from. And so having this kind of control over the way I work, and being able to really use my skills for my clients in ways that add value to them, this is living the dream, right. I'm so so grateful. So yeah, having the ability to really control how you work, when you work, how much you want to work, it's a privilege, it's an absolute privilege. And then when I see the difference it can make for my clients, that's really, that turns me right on, being able to add value in ways that really makes sense for them and a difference for them, I love that.
Oh, Pat, that’s the dream, it's the dream and being able to build that business during a pandemic is a blessing, right? Because we all figured out how to use Zoom, we all figured out how to work remotely, like it just became part of the everyday part of the norm; Two Four One was founded during that time too, and wouldn't exist today if this hadn't happened. Right now, we wouldn't be talking to you in St. Lucia on a podcast. So it's a huge blessing the way everything is worked out and people like you who figured it out and found a better path for yourself and a new way forward, it's so exciting. But of course not without challenges we know that comes with it and resilience is a big part of getting through. So we love to ask people, of course, we are called Resilient Entrepreneurs. What does resilience mean to you?
Resilience really is about picking yourself back up and keeping on going, in its essence. So to me, if you're knocked over by something, if there's a setback, you take the lesson, as I said, you decide how you're going to grow from that and you keep going. Resilience is not stopping, it's always looking forward and keeping on going. It can be hard, it can be really hard. I think I've been really, really blessed with getting this business together and the way that things have rolled out for me. But even when you're knocked down, I mean, I've had moments when I thought, oh my gosh, really should I be doing this? With all of that because as an entrepreneur, you are going to have those moments. It might be having a really late night, and there's a deadline on your forehead and you're thinking you should be further along than you are, in the middle of the night. You're kind of thinking should I have done this? But resilient is you taking the hit, getting up, learning from it, and then just keep moving forward.
Yeah, what scares you most Pat?
Aside from anything bad happening to my family, that's the thing that scares me most. Yeah, anything happening to my family. You can't let fear get in the way. You can't let fear get in the way. I can't pinpoint any one thing, apart from that big thing for me. But you will have days that scare, you have weeks that scare you, because of various things. But when you are scared and I say this to even some of my coaching clients, you have to use fear as fuel. You've got to use fear as fuel and run towards what scares you. This is a principle that I've had all through my career as well for myself, in fact, the title of my upcoming book. One day, one day, I’ve got it in mind.
Okay, what's the title? We’ll look out for it.
Run Towards What Scares You. I've really lived by that principle. I've done things that had me quaking in my boots.
Like what?
Okay, I'll give you a story. Very early on in tourism 101, the first time around in tourism because BTA was the second time around for me. I had prepared a presentation for my boss at the time and it was a very important presentation. It was going to be 100 of the most senior travel agents from across the US were coming to Bermuda. It was a big breakfast presentation that he was going to make and they were big producers for Bermuda, so they were really important. So I made this presentation, did this deck, I ran through it with him, made sure I pinned him down to rehearse and all the rest of it, I knew this thing inside and out. Come the morning, there's no sign of him. I'm at Hamilton Princess, there’s 100 travel agents in the room and other people in the room, no sign of him. I’m getting nervous, I finally get the message that he's sick and he can't come. And no one else was prepared to make this presentation, they had no clue. He and I had gone through it, I knew it and so who had to make the presentation? Yeah. So I ran to the bathroom just to make sure that I actually wasn't going to throw up and to stop myself from shaking. So I went back to the room, went to the podium, thank God there was a podium, I hung on to it - I was literally telling this story last week to a group coaching session - I hung onto this podium like my life depended on it, I think I left my fingerprints in it, and I had to make this presentation. I knew it, thank God because I drafted it but that was a huge saving grace but I really was not expecting that. At the time, I really did not want to present anything. I was happy producing decks for people and sending them on their way to do well and slay the room, but I never meant, I didn't like public speaking at all. So I made the presentation to these senior people and I got a rousing round of applause after.
And so you know, this is a growth opportunity, right? If you're confronted with something that is scaring you to no end, embrace it, try to find out how you're going to grow from it, discern how you're going to grow from it. Prepare for it, I mean, if you can prepare for it. If you're prepared you're in a much better place to be successful obviously, but don't run away from it. I think these things are sent to help you grow and even if it doesn't go, if it's like a 70% or 80% or 85% success, you did it, right? You did it. That's another notch on your belt, another growth opportunity so run towards what scares you.
Great advice. Oh, my goodness. So we're all going to practise that. Find something that scares you and run towards it. Laura and I often talk about the growth is outside of the comfort zone and we sometimes will look at ourselves, look at each other in a meeting, it has happened a couple of times and we'll just say, I’m feeling a bit comfortable here, what can we do to stretch?
Yeah, that's great. Yeah. How can you stretch? What makes you stretch? I love that. Yeah.
And it's not talking to hundreds of strangers when you're not expecting to, but you know what? Sometimes it feels like it in the moment. So good on you. Great story. Thanks. And yes, you've shared some really fun examples today. And thanks so much for your candour and your wisdom and your experience. And I think it's going to be so helpful to all of our listeners. So it's been an absolute pleasure chatting, Pat. Thank you.
Thank you for having me. I do hope it's helpful. Thank you so much.
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