ļ»æVicki
Yeah. So Tanya, it's so good to have you on the show. Thank you so much for joining us. We're excited to hear about your skills and what you bring to the entrepreneurial space as it relates to accountability groups and focus. You've got some very cool techniques that can be used right in the middle to help people get through their day.
First, we're going to talk about your personal journey. So yeah there's a question I'm dying to ask. Shall I ask it forward? okay. Tanya, when you were a kid, your mom bought you a cash register. This is the cutest story. Please share with us what you did with that cash register. This is the story of how you got to be an entrepreneur, I think.
Tanya Alvarez
Yeah, the first story, my sonās always asking me, were you always an entrepreneur? I go, I guess so. I was so excited. She got me his cash register and it was around Christmas time and she had a holiday party. So I sat myself up right in front of the door and started charging everybody.
And there, you have a little girl saying, Hey, if you want to get in you have to pay. They're like, I was getting $20 and that's a lot. So I was excited. And that was my entry into like, yeah, you could start charging for anything.
Vicki
That is so cute. And so where did you go from there in entrepreneurship?
Tanya Alvarez
So I had a taste of entrepreneurship. And then when I graduated from Wellesley in 2000, the bubble burst, the technology bubble burst, everybody in that school ends up being either some are investment bankers, management consultants, typical like routes or going to grad school, but I still wanted to go into the startup world. So I said no to American Express in their marketing department. I said no to a bunch of jobs. And I decided to go to New York and work at startups. And I did everything, anything you can imagine. I was like, I'm going to learn as much as I can. And then at the age of 25, I was like, I want to do it. I want to start my own thing. I feel like I've learned a lot.
So I asked my mother who bought that cash register and I said, I want to start my own thing, but I'm terrified. And she goes, you should just do it. And I go, well, what happens if I fail? And she goes, you'll be exactly where you are now working for someone and I was like, okay, well, what happens if nobody wants to hire me? And she goes, you wouldn't want to work for a company like that. And what I realized is I had nothing to lose, so I went for it.
Vicki
I love your mother. I already love your mother. What sound advice.
Laura
That's amazing. And you know how rare it is to have somebody like that in your life that just tells you to go for it? Often the people who surround us say, you no, get a safe job. It's too risky. You might lose everything, but you had the encouragement to go for it. That's incredible.
Tanya Alvarez
And especially from somebody, a mother who immigrated from Columbia and was a single mom of four, you would think she would say, wait, you went to this college and now you're to do this? Like what's going on? But she was like, no, go for it. This is the time. So I'm really fortunate.
Laura
You're really fortunate, really blessed in that. And also, I think another thing you said there is really key, and it's a good thing to point out to other entrepreneurs, is that you went to work for startups on purpose. Because I think what most people don't realize is that in a big corporation, you're sort of a low man on the totem pole, you don't learn a whole lot other than what skills you need to do for the job versus working for a startup, you kind of gotta wear a lot of the hats, do a lot of the things that are happening, and you get to be really, really close with the entrepreneur. So what kind of lessons did you learn just being in that sort of environment versus being in a big corporate America?
Tanya Alvarez
So like you said, in corporate America, you're kind of doing this small thing, right? And in a startup, it's like they need so many things and they can't afford it. So you become that everything. You got to figure it out. You have to be resourceful. So it's like, you need marketing? great. You need somebody to pick up the phone? Great. And you need sales? Shoot. Okay. I guess I'm going to learn how to sell. And one of the big things in most startups is they have you doing sales, even if you're in marketing because they need to know. So like, I started learning all the things to run and I was like, I got this. I can figure it out. And I think my biggest thing is, when I was in college, I interned for the US Olympic committee and it was like one of these hard ones to get an opportunity. I forgot, it was like thousands of applications, thereās only like 50 slots and I got it.
And they wanted me to put all this database work like all these papers into a database. And that was my whole internship. I was like, are you kidding me? I went through this whole thing. So then I grabbed the computer, the data, I stayed up for 24 hours. I got it all done. They didn't think I was going to do that. And then I turned it in and I was like, I'm done. What's next? And they were like, what do you mean? That was your whole summer project. I go, okay, well it's done. And they were like, and I was like, I really want to see how Nike or this sponsorship and this and then I got to do things. So I think for anybody listening to this, it's like, get the experience, right? Cause everyone has these books, there's like so many things out there, but you really need to just dig in and get the experience and have people trust you by being proactive.
Laura
Yeah, that's solid advice.
Vicki
That is such a great lesson because too often you'd have an internship and just be disappointed at what they've given you and put up with it and go, that didn't work out. And woe is me, look at you. You just flipped that completely, took charge, knew what you wanted. You were intentional about it as well. You knew what you wanted. I think that's a really big secret to success. What do you think?
Tanya Alvarez
I agree. It's figuring out what you want and then being resourceful at it. Like how can you get this done quickly and not being like, well, this is it. You're right. I didn't choose. I was like, this is my whole summer. Great. Now it was like, no, there has to be something else.
Laura
Yeah, absolutely. So tell us about starting up your first business. What was that like?
Tanya Alvarez
I'm just trying to think about that. I just went for it. I was fortunate enough to grow to over 1 million within the first year. And when I was growing it, I was still going through a lot. I felt like I needed to figure everything out on my own. I think that's a big mistake a lot of entrepreneurs have. We think that even if we have a team, we need to know it all. And another thing is like hiring people, like, no, if we hire somebody smarter than us. Will they take over the business? Like all these limiting beliefs are like, you're just too damn close to your own business to see it. And that sounding board. So it was just like, even though achievement wise, like, wow, I grew it over 1 million. It was great. There was just so many things I could have avoided if I had a sounding board around me. But the only people that were my sounding boards were like competitors, right? At this point and when I first started my company, there wasn't AI, there wasn't a bunch of things. And even if you have AI, it's still general advice. It's not tailored to your business. Right.
So I think that's the big thing that there's so much information out there that there's this one time when this client I've had for years, they ended up running a balance of a hundred thousand dollars. And so like, I was like, shoot, what do I do? So I asked my family, they're like, you should sue. And I'm, oh, and then you read on the line and you're like, yeah, you should sue. And then you start realizing, so I did sue and guess what ended up happening? I barely got that much money back. But the bigger thing was the energy that was involved in that I could have made up by using that energy to generate more money. And that was a big lesson that only another entrepreneur who knows it would tell me.
But see, we go on these forums, we go on these platforms, we ask these questions and then we don't even know who the other person is giving that advice. They probably read it from, I don't know, some TikTok. They're like, yeah, you should sue, right? And then we apply it and then we're like, shoot. Or people with the best intentions, like your family, if they're not business owners, how would they know? That was the biggest aha moment for me. And I was like, I'm feeling very alone, feeling very isolated. And what can I do to stop myself from feeling this? All this pressure on me and not having all the answers.
Vicki
So what was the answer to that? What can you do?
Tanya Alvarez
So one of the big things is I was training for the Boston Marathon. And even though I was a collegiate cross-country runner and track, I still joined a team of people because then, athletes who wanted the same thing, to do really well in the Boston Marathon. And as I was running, because like they're still dealing with the same thing, like how do I have a life? How do I have training? How do I get around an injury? All these questions. We also had a coach that we had to report our stats to and held us accountable to what are our times? But it was that group of people that I got to be with that helped me exponentially learn and avoid mistakes. So here I am running and I was like, what? I do this in sports, I do this with friends, any activity, but why the heck am I not doing this in business? Because what happens is when you go in these other business groups, it's like this big, big community and sure, you're in this big community, but I've never been the type in school to raise my hand. I've always been the one that's, I listen, I do my work, I get everything done, but never the one that's out there. And I started realizing that's how I am in communities too, that are really big. I like the small groups and I hideout. I'm not the one asking the questions. When I was running, it was so small that I couldn't hide out, right. We all knew each other, we were all going for the same goal. And so that's what I wanted to create. And that's how Owners Up, my current company, is.
Laura
So tell us more about how that works, keep it small, because obviously a small group can turn into a big one easily. How do you manage to keep it intimate? Because I hear you, I am exactly the same. I so resonate with everything you just said. I think it's a little bit of introvertedness that, small groups, I'm really chatty, one-on-one, talk all day, but in a big group, I'll definitely be the one sitting in the background. So tell us about how it works and how your business works.
Tanya Alvarez
Yeah, so with Owners Up, we have one big call where we all get together. So then we have that vulnerability and a setting of belonging to something bigger than we are. But then everyone breaks out into groups of four, right? And then in there, we have this social accountability. You got to be on time. You got to do your goals. If you don't, in that big call, we announce it. And then you have that social disappointment. So you want to avoid that, right? But we do it in a playful way, but that's just for you to be held accountable. Because as business owners, we can always justify our goals. Like, that wasn't that important. I'm going to move to the next thing, you know, or keep ourselves busy on other things. And then within the group, so everyone's in breakout rooms on zoom, everybody has 15 minutes and we have a question structure where you say, what is the biggest question? And we have a format so people aren't asking vague questions. And then everyone gets feedback and then it's the same thing week after week. And then every month, this is the biggest thing. See, as entrepreneurs really either too, we'll say like, imagine this, I'm going to write a book and I'm going to write a book in a month. No, that's kind of hard. Like are we going to have the time. And we do that with goals all the time. So in this case, we help them actually on the call, they get their goal and then they break it down to seven to eight hours - that goal and they have to be held accountable to that goal each week.
Vicki
How big is the group at the moment?
Tanya Alvarez
So we have hundreds, we've been running this company for a while. And the biggest breakthrough was I thought I had to facilitate all the calls, because I actually enjoyed facilitating. But now what I realize is when you have a structure, you can actually break it down with people just being with others. Entrepreneurs are just longing for others. And the sounding board, even if I know I'm pretty good at goals and breaking down my goals, you know what I'm always missing? Feedback. I'm too close to my own copy. When it's marketing, I can help anybody in different things, but when it's my own, just too close. So that feedback is what I need to keep moving. And the same thing with running. When I had the coach correcting me on my stride on things, it was just, I was too close to it.
Laura
That makes total sense. I think it's so fascinating how entrepreneurship is like its own category of working, way to work. And yet it is completely different in the industry and the types of things that people do, whether they're creating a retail business or an e-commerce one or doing a service. But yet we all deal with the same core of issues. And a lot of it is that being so alone, especially solo entrepreneurs, right? Or when you're starting up and we work a lot with startups and that's when the issues are the highest and you need the community the most. So what advice do you have for someone who's thinking about doesn't have a community yet and thinking about do I need one? Do I not need one? Is this something I'm going to budget for? You know, if you have a budget that's tight, like how people understand the value that you actually get the return on investment of communities. Because I think this is a really important point, and I believe so strongly in them. But I'd love to hear it from your perspective as someone who runs this type of business.
Tanya Alvarez
Just try and think of a really good analogy because burnout is so real. I think when you go out on your own, it's the burnout. Yes, you can do everything on your own. Here's a perfect analogy. So I recently just did a century ride with it, which is a hundred miles on a bike. And when you're in a group, you go so much faster and it's so much fun. You're like even if you're going at a fast pace, it was great. So I was going 23 miles per hour, which was super fast for me that I would never be able to do it on my own. Then all of sudden, someone in the group was going way too fast up a hill and I couldn't handle that one, so I got dropped and then I was by myself. And guess what? When you're by yourself, you start spiraling down. There was thoughts like I'm going to quit. This is not going to happen. This is so hard. How many more miles? My legs are cramping. Everything you can imagine. And then you get like a break, you get water. And then I joined another group and I was back at it. It was seamless. It was like I wasn't even on a bike ride. So on alone, it's just, you're burning out. It's just, you're in your thoughts and you just need that perspective, right? And then that helps you out because you're just like, I'm not alone in this. People are experiencing this. And then when you get to see somebody else have that breakthrough on the other side, you're excited again. But when you're by yourself, sometimes you don't see that breakthrough.
Laura
Absolutely. Have you yourself ever experienced burnout?
Tanya Alvarez
Yes, in the beginning when I didn't have a group. Heck yeah. It looked like from the outside I had everything going and then I was just working crazy hours like coffee was my friends, right? And it was, I was like, shoot, I gotta do this, especially to afford all my staff. But then there was one thing I did that was kind of naive and I had no clue. So growing up, we came from a household where there was food, food wasn't always there, and house, all that scarcity, but I never got to travel. And I was like, I really wanna travel. So was like, shoot, how do I do this? And my office was on Park and 23rd. So to hire people in marketing at that time was really pricey, especially in New York. So how the heck am I gonna go away? And I wanted to go to Peru. I went to hike Machu Picchu.
So I was like, hmm. What am I going to do? And I ended up saying, all right, maybe I can hire an account manager and this is before UpWork and all those places. And I was like, let me find somebody in Columbia and they have perfect English and he studied and all of that. And then let me hire a CTO and all this. So I hired all these people and I was like, all right, they're doing well. It was like five people for the cost of one US person. I was really good. I was like, okay, well, I have a certain amount of time to get all this done and everything was working out. And then I was like, hey guys, I trust you. If there's an emergency you can handle it, and tell my clients I'll be back and nothing's gonna stop, right? And so I went back, I came back, they were just empowered. I was like, wow, everything worked without me. And then the little things that got messed up, like maybe some communication, I was like, all right, I'll work on this.
So now every quarter I would go away and I would empower my team to be like, that's helped me systemize my business even more. It rewarded me to take that break from not burning out. And then it allowed me to see what was working and what needs to be optimized in my business. By the way, that was just naive, just wanting to travel and not knowing any better of like, I didn't know what could happen. What would be the worst thing that could happen? I lost my company. Okay, that's really bad, but I guess, I just gotta start it up again.
Vicki
I love this resilience. And that's what led you to travel to 42 countries Tanya and build an incredible business that people as you said were feeling empowered because you were giving them the opportunity to shine, to show you, to show themselves what they were capable of. I think that's such an interesting and it's a poignant fact. People say I can't trust them to do such and such. I don't know if they have the capacity. Well, how will you know if you don't give them the opportunity to know? And I think this is something that you see in parenting a lot too is, know, no, I can't let my kid do that because he's too young or she, but perhaps if you gave them the opportunity to try with the guided eye, then that person, that little young person would feel empowered and thrive.
Tanya Alvarez
I've heard that. I heard like right now I have a two and four year old, but I asked my friends who have teenagers and they said, well, the hard part about teenage years is all of a sudden when you're young, you're trying to make sure that they survive, youāre helping them, you're guiding them. And then when they're teenagers, you kind of have to let them and trust them. And that's hard. That transition that you've had all those years. I was like, that's a good analogy. Yeah.
Vicki
Laura is an amazing example of this.
Laura
As a parent of teenagers, yes, I will definitely agree. It's very true. You go from taking care of their basic needs, food, shelter, those things, to taking care of their mental needs. And you turn into a coach, a therapist, a friend, as well as a guide. And it's a really, really cool space to be in. I feel like if you did a good job in the early years, the teenagers are going to be okay. So definitely, my son's an entrepreneur building his own business. and I should say this, because I'm going to put this out in the universe. He said, I want to tell people 20 years from now that I never had a job. I never worked for someone. I only worked for myself. And I was ok, that's pretty cool.
Tanya Alvarez
He can get that shirt that says āunemployableā.
Laura
Unemployable, love it. Yes, exactly. Unemployable. I hope he is. I hope he does. He's on his way. But I think that empowerment is so important. I think there's a reason a lot of people don't become entrepreneurs when they're doing a side hustle or they've got this great idea. Everyone's got their million dollar idea, but a lot of people don't action it because of fear. The fear of everything, the fear of failure, sometimes even the fear of success can actually be a fear. So let's talk about that. Like have you ever had times when the fear got you or maybe you hesitated or didn't want to take the risk? I mean, I think all of us can have a story, right?
Tanya Alvarez
So thinking of a childhood where I wanted to fit in and not stand out because my family was very unique. Here I was, she's a single mom. Her oldest has a rare disease called osteogenesis imperfecta, which is brittle bones. So she's always been a wheelchair user. I found out I had it in my twenties, but I don't have it as severe. But like you have this family that doesn't look alike, but you're trying to fit in. Right? So my whole life has always been trying to fit in so people don't realize that, hey, I'm actually struggling financially that I don't have the resources that every, like all these little things that everybody has their own kind of form of that. And now I'm supposed to go out there and tell my story and be vulnerable and be okay with like, if I put a story out in the comments and some haters or whatever it is. Of course, my little girl in me, the fear of being judged and not fitting is strong. It's still until this day strong. And the only way I found to overcome that is through other people going through that, wanting to remind themselves that this isn't about them. It's about something bigger than them. And then having a challenge.
So I've had challenges within our Owners Up groups where we have it where it's 30 days of telling their story. Right, and then as in the group, kind of you like, you comment. So you have other people supporting you and helping you out and then cheering you on. And we're all saying, we're terrified and we're going to do it anyway. So I think anytime you're scared, just do it. Like when I went skydiving, skydiving, like that's not something that I'm like, yay, I want to jump off a plane. I do, but you have to sign this piece of paper. But when you do it with other friends, you don't want to be the only one that's like, no, I'm not going to do it. I'm going to check it out. So always address your fears with others.
Vicki
Gold, gold, because that ties back to you saying how when you feel like you have to do it all on your own, it can feel too heavy and that's when you crumble. So Tanya, let's put this into a bit of a hero's journey. So in just bullet points, how would you summarize your journey? As it relates to you set off on this path, there was something you wanted to achieve. First of all, what was the challenge that you overcame when you said, yes, I'm going to do this. And then the next question is going to be who was the mentor that you met along the way that helped you onto the right path?
Tanya Alvarez
That's a great one. I always think about the hero's journey and then how to and of course here it is, maybe we should use this group scenario because when it's your own, you don't see it. But when it's somebody else's, you can totally see it. So for me, I'm going to think what my hero's journey is and you can jump in based on what you've heard. So we're to do this group thing. I find it that there's a belief of working hard and being an overachiever. And so the challenge was I need to do it all by myself and I also didn't have the resources and the support. So that was the biggest challenge, admitting that. And then going to other people. And I remember even with the running, here I was a top runner. Then finding out that other runners were dealing with the same thing I was, that was the whole eureka moment where it was like you guys are going through this fear of not doing this time or like saying no to partying because I was in my twenties, right? And going and running. I'm not alone. And then thinking, how can that happen in the business world? Right. And then the journey was now, how do I find these people? Because the big myth about accountability is that it's people who need accountability, they don't follow through. But actually, it's the freaking overachievers because what they do is they take on too much and they don't have boundaries. So my people are overachievers who need boundaries and that's the big thing. So now I had to like, the big challenge was how do I get people who it's like, how do I say, there's two levels, right? There's people who are like, there's a mental mindset that they can't even start. And then there's people who are starting, but taking on too many things.
Vicki
Yeah, I'm digging that. I hear that they need boundaries and they also need a reality check. And I think they're getting that with your goal setting. As you said, too often we take on a big chunk and it's too much. We're not going to write a book in a month unless that's the only thing we're doing. And so I love that analogy you shared because boundaries is one thing, it's like you're taking on everybody's stuff and you're saying, well, I can't allocate this, I have to do it myself. Your group helps people to realize what is their best use of their time. So if that was the path, who was your mentor?
Tanya Alvarez
I've had so many mentors, like my family has just been the mentor that - you always need people - that's really important in your group. You always need people to remind you of who you are because when you're in it, you're spiraling. That's just the truth. And anyone who says they're not spiraling, that's BS. Like when you come through some challenges or you have to make tough things, like you're second guessing yourself. You forget all the things you do.
So, one recommendation I have for everybody is I have on my notes section and my phone, it's called āI'm possibleā, which was impossible. So things that you thought that you could never achieve, how did you feel? And then when you accomplished it, what lessons did you learn? And so when I'm going through something, I always look at that and I'm like, I was able to do this. I thought it was impossible. Like I can do this. I can do this. So it's my little reminder of who I am and then other people reminding me because it's so easy to forget, right? It's kind of like giving birth, right? We all forget. It's like, and we do it again. So it's, you have to be reminded like, yeah, you went through that.
Laura
Yeah. If you didn't forget, you probably wouldn't do it again. And I think that's a little bit like for entrepreneurs too. Like sometimes you got to forget the things you went through or like minimize the moment when you were in it. Cause sometimes it is very stressful. It's difficult. And there's times people want to quit. Did you ever have a moment of that's it, I'm out of this. I'm going to quit.
Tanya Alvarez
Yeah, of course, everyone does, right? At some point. And you start doubting yourself. And then you just have people reminding you of like, wow, the difference you made and what you're doing.
Laura
Yeah. my moment was when I realized I was actually making more money freelancing and not working for somebody else than going and getting an actual job for somebody else. I was like, wait, hang on a second. I have freedom and flexibility and time and I don't have to work for somebody else and I'm making more money. Then it was like the big aha for me. So absolutely a lot of it's our own limiting beliefs. It's our own internal things, which exactly being in a community like yours helps people to understand it's their limiting beliefs and that's not actually the reality and how we can move forward. So that's exciting. I love what you're doing. It's such a great space to be in. And of course we're resilient entrepreneurs and you are clearly a very resilient entrepreneur that helps others to become so. So what in your opinion is how does one become resilient?
Tanya Alvarez
Great is my work, but I'm actually curious because you guys are the marketing brain trust. What was my hero's journey in your framework?
Vicki
Yeah, I'm still getting to what the biggest dragon was for you. So the one thing that almost made you quit, that's going to be a big dragon, the big fire breathing block that you had to slay to win. Maybe you're still on the journey. That's possible. Maybe you haven't met your big, big green dragon yet. That's exciting.
Tanya Alvarez
Yeah, challenges are a new kind of breakthrough, a new being. Bring it on! Now, bring it on when I have people around me, right? Not by myself.
Laura
But can I argue we can also ride the dragon like in Game of Thrones, you know, like a Targaryen. Can we just be like that and just ride the dragon? It doesn't have to be slayed. Maybe it's just how you get on challenge.
Vicki
I love that. Yeah. Because that way we're accepting all the parts of us because I've personally as a coach I see over and over that people's dragons are coming from within right? That we've talked about limiting beliefs here today and those are the massive dragons. Those are the things that hold us back from doing the thing we truly want to do. You can have structure in place. You can have accountability groups. You can have incredible ideas. You can have Wall Street brilliance and money. You can have whatever you want, but if it's not happening from here. You're holding yourself back and that's the biggest dragon. Because we don't slay our inner self. You talked about your little girl. We're not going to slay our little girl, we're going to honour her. We're going to, you know, hold her. We're going to help her feel safe because that's the fear. So we're always going to accept those parts of us. And if we ride the dragon, to Laura's point, then we're going together as friends.
Fear becomes our friend. You know, all those emotions and limiting beliefs become our friend and we go together and together we're stronger. I'm digging this. We just created something in that moment. Thank you for the opportunity, Tanya.
Tanya Alvarez
Yeah, and I was also thinking about, like, a lot of people talk about accountability. And what we do differently is, going back to you, is if somebody, we do give them their consequence, but then we talk about what is underneath it, why it didn't happen. It's usually perfectionism. It's usually this knowledge gap. Or the third one is kind of like not time, they're time management, right? But there's a limiting beliefs beyond that. And if you actually, you can give as many consequences as you want, and they're going to continue getting those consequences. But if you don't move that limiting belief, it's not happening. So that's a great point. I totally forgot about that one. Yep.
Vicki
Spot on. Because time management is important, obviously, and it can be learned to an extent. But if there's a procrastination strategy running underneath, that time management is never going to get you where you want it to be. Right? Because whatever it is that's digging your heels in, that's always going to be there until you see it and befriend it. Ride the dragon.
Laura
One thing that's so clear about entrepreneurship in general is that it's our own personal development journey. Like, no matter what type of entrepreneur you are, doesn't matter what industry you're in, you have to undertake personal development in order to get to success. It just is part of it. Like, you've got to get through your childhood experiences, any limiting beliefs to work through these things and to get the help, get the communities, get the coaching, the support, whatever it is you need. Hey, listen to more podcasts. Find the support wherever you can find it because it is an interesting journey, but it's one you're gonna learn more about yourself on than anything else. You can go to all the retreats in the world, but you wanna take on real person development, take on entrepreneurship.
You have to wear so many hats like you were saying in the beginning. You have to learn about how to manage people and be a leader, how to find your voice in that. All of it is developing yourself into a bigger, better, stronger version of you. And I think it's such an incredible, exciting journey to go on. And it's what gets me up in the mornings, to talk about entrepreneurship, to talk about this journey with amazing people like you, Tanya. I thank you so much for your time today. You have great stories. You explain it so well, you make the case for these accountability groups and the value of them so well. So I hope people take it on. We'll of course share information on that in the show notes if anyone is interested in joining or creating their own accountability groups. Let us know, tell us. Stay in touch with us so that we know what you're doing out there in the world too. So I just wanna take the time to say thank you, Tanya. This was an incredible conversation and just really appreciate it.
Tanya Alvarez
Thank you. Thank you for having me. I really enjoyed it.